Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by 4.of.Clubs »

Justin O. wrote: I agree with you guys for the most part, but I generally prefer Kickstarter than just buying a deck off a webstore
This is what I thought a year ago, but I've also been burnt many times where the decks is on sale after KS for a cheaper price (that's a whole other topic).

I agree KS is still a good ground for creators and backers to discuss and contribute to the project, but for the known creators, I personally can't recall recently where they changed their design based of what KS backers have said (Jackson did take a couple notes from UC on the legal tender). Nowadays, what they put on the product page is usually what you're getting. The only projects I back on KS now is if it's a limited deck I want that I know will cost more after release.

For creators like Jackson and Lotrek, we're not buying $10-$15 decks anymore, most of the decks are now $25+ (or much higher). Why are we paying such a premium? because we trust that the decks will be as designed, with the features promised... and with that trust and $$$ from backers, I would expect them to deliver.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by double_left »

4.of.Clubs wrote: Nowadays, what they put on the product page is usually what you're getting.
Wrong!! Black Diamond - Tactical edition is a prime example! From Bullet proof titanium to now, a wood display!
4.of.Clubs wrote: Why are we paying such a premium? because we trust that the decks will be as designed, with the features promised...
Wrong!!
Texas - The color of the Texas deck changed without notice.
Black Diamond - Legacy boxes design changed without notice.
4.of.Clubs wrote: I would expect them to deliver.
Lately with JR projects, all I can say is..... :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by 4.of.Clubs »

double_left wrote:
4.of.Clubs wrote: Nowadays, what they put on the product page is usually what you're getting.
Wrong!! Black Diamond - Tactical edition is a prime example! From Bullet proof titanium to now, a wood display!
4.of.Clubs wrote: Why are we paying such a premium? because we trust that the decks will be as designed, with the features promised...
Wrong!!
Texas - The color of the Texas deck changed without notice.
Black Diamond - Legacy boxes design changed without notice.
Not sure what point you are trying to make, in regards to the first quote, I was talking about designs/colors. Where creators used to change the tuck/back/pips with backer feedback - this doesn't happen anymore for known creators.

Second, if you read the whole post, I'm saying that's what I EXPECT but AM NOT GETTING - that's why I don't pledge on KS anymore.

Please read the whole post and not pick sentences out of context and quote people...
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by Lotrek »

I think we're a bit off topic but the discussion is interesting anyway and I was mentioned, so let me add my thoughts.

KS is primarily a site where you can get the funds you need to do something new. Doing something new means that there is a possibility of a mistake (or more). Unless you plan to screw your backers and run away with their money, mistakes and delays are in the program.
Ideally, I agree that experiments should be held in the shadow and only the successful ones should be announced and sold.
But: During the past 2 years I have acquired a huge amount of knowledge regarding offset printing and what I can say is that what you imagine or envision is far from the reality. You cannot experiment with printing unless your dad is running a big printing company. And you cannot "print a few sheets", simply because you pay the same money whether you're printing 10 sheets or 1000. And sometimes unexpected things can happen even when you're not experimenting and you're just doing an ordinary printing.

I think that a creative mind cannot be imprisoned within the limits of ordinary decks. I cannot stop myself from inventing but really, I wish I could. It's very stressful and financially exhausting but I guess it's a sort of addiction. Some people are addicted to collecting, others are addicted to getting in trouble with their innovations
However, I have taken some steps in creating in a more safe manner, both for my backers and for me. LITURGY Treasure is an example. It was prepared long ago, quietly executed with the knowledge I acquired over time, ALWAYS with fingers crossed and thankfully without problems, apart from the hard personal work.
Personally I like learning from my mistakes and not repeating them too much (I can always go for new ones!!).
I'm soon to announce big changes in all aspects of my playing card designing/producing that will be for the better, both for my backers and for me.
I begin with arresting Victor Jose :lol: :lol: :lol:

KS as a platform has nothing to do with how projects are executed and if there was no KS at all, there would have been no such diversity in playing card design. One has to decide if they'll fund a project that will probably be delayed -sometimes considerably- or wait when the deck is available later at a higher price. In some creators' cases usually double or triple.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by vasta41 »

@Lotrek Mistakes and delays are one thing- and like you said, should be expected IMO. But offering one thing and selling another is a totally different story which is something Jackson has done more than once now:
CRAZY 8s
What was offered: embossing on LTD tuck case
What was sold: NO embossing on LTD tuck case (in fairness an extra autographed deck was included for free)

TEXAS
What was offered: a black on blue color scheme on the back of the cards
What was sold: a black on very dark grey, almost black color scheme

TALLY-HO BLACK DIAMOND
What was offered: metal tuck case
What (will be) sold: wooden tuck case

LEGAL TENDER
What was offered: holographic strip on court cards
What (will be) sold: no holographic strips

Those examples don't include the mistakes that were made in these and other projects (again, mistakes happen) but rather false advertisement, more or less. I will be backing the Pearl edition here because I think it and all of Jackson's other work is beautiful. My only point here is like I said in an earlier post: BUYER BEWARE. Careful getting your hopes up for ground breaking add-ons or features based on past experience.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by ccralleo »

I know recently it has been hard with Jacksons projects. I am disappointed that it may no longer be a metal tuck in regards to the Tactical Edition. But we don't know the whole story with UGT and why they backed out. It sucks that what was purchased was not set in stone and for many months a select few of us have been in the dark on this... but I never count my chickens before they hatch... I'm looking forward to, hopefully, a different kind of legacy than previously seen in other projects. But either way I am grateful, as a collector, to have his decks in my collection. It's nice to see how far he has come and what is possible these days... maybe no holographic strips this time but new knowledge gained for stunning decks in the future! I'm looking forward to the Pearl Tally Ho's and hopefully it will go smoothly and restore some faith in Jackson. I'm rooting for him!


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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by th4mo »

Lotrek wrote:KS is primarily a site where you can get the funds you need to do something new. Doing something new means that there is a possibility of a mistake (or more). Unless you plan to screw your backers and run away with their money, mistakes and delays are in the program.
I don't wanna rehash much of what has been said already in this thread, but I think Lotrek hits the nail on the head here.

Kickstarter is NOT a store.

Not getting exactly what you thought you were going to get is only ONE of the risks that you must accept as part of the package.

Don't like that? The very simple answer has already been offered many times: wait until the item is available on the regular market, and pay market prices. No one is forcing you to back anything on KS.

That said, Jackson's record speaks for itself - for better or worse - and no one who reads this forum can claim ignorance of the risks.

As for myself, i've lost the desire to pay a premium for nothing more than a fancy box, and the whole KWP Tally Ho line is starting to get a bit boring... :(
Keep it Sizzlin'!
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by Bikefanatic »

From KS, I'll only just get the cards, none of the cool looking extra stuff unless it's already made. Usually cases are the problem, still waiting on one of them.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by guru »

I second what Lotrek said above. Due to Kickstarter there is a renewed interest in custom playing cards and I know lots of people who started collecting after Federal 52. I read here that people are disappointed because things have not gone well with recent projects by JR. Has someone thought about the kind of disappointment JR would have faced after getting to know that his vision for such a design may not be realized because of such and such challenges. How much emotional toll he would have endured when making certain tradeoffs and decisions? Same would have been the case with Lotrek. I've been through similar emotional ups and downs with Divine Art project though it may not be on the similar lines as in the projects I mentioned above because of no. of backers, multiple reward levels etc.

This should not be seen as a plea or an excuse but just another viewpoint from a creator's perspective. In the end, it is all learning, every creator learns something from the project execution, similarly every backer goes on the journey with creator and have their fair share of lessons learned. Are they able to apply their learnings on future projects and to what extent is the question both parties should be asking themselves regularly.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by jerichoholic »

Jackson, and all creators, should make sure their visions are possible before launching them.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by rousselle »

Pretty sure that Jackson thought his vision was do-able before he launched the project.

Pretty sure Lotrek did, too. And every other project creator who has dared to propose one on Kickstarter. Even Adam "Green Army Men" Clarkson certainly expected he'd be able to deliver.

The problem, as I see it, is HOW YOU RESPOND TO ADVERSITY. When it turns out that Adam hit a speed bump on the way to bringing his project to completion, he folded up and ran. With my money.

That is not what Jackson, or Lotrek, or many other of our favorite creators do.

Every single time that Jackson has run into adversity (which is always a greater risk for the project creators who try more audacious projects), he has tried to find a way to still deliver something his backers would feel was worth the effort. And, so far at least, every time that has been an open question, he has also offered money back to any backer who didn't like the proposed resolution. The same is true of Lotrek. The same is true of any number of our favorite creators whose reach has occasionally exceeded their grasp.

I, for one, hope that Jackson continues to try audacious new ideas (and Lotrek, and others.) Sure, I also hope they adjust their approach as they learn what doesn't work and what does. But, for crying out loud, there's no glory if you don't take a risk, and that's what Kickstarter is about; letting us help in sharing the risk and, hopefully, enjoying a piece of the glory when it comes around.

If more creators took your proposed path of only doing what they know will work, there'd be no need for Kickstarter at all. And no experimentation. And, universal banality.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by Lotrek »

@rousselle:

+1000
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by serubi »

Those tuck boxes are looking fiiine!
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by ccralleo »

@rousselle
Agree 1000%!


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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by badpete69 »

Live and sold out

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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by jerichoholic »

Actually not sold out, plenty of single decks left. I'm guessing more will be added on later?
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by Bikefanatic »

I would've pledged for four gilded decks but it wasn't a tier for that.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by jerichoholic »

I'm not asking anyone to abandon audacious ideas just to try it out first, make a prototype, see if it's doable, not wait until after a project is done to find out, I don't think that's too much to ask.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by PrincessTrouble »

He just added more slots to two of the legacy edition tier editions. Act fast if you want one.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by PrincessTrouble »

PrincessTrouble wrote:He just added more slots to two of the legacy edition tier editions. Act fast if you want one.
And the extra G1 and H1 slots are sold out now.

Still plenty of A1s and C1s.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by serubi »

I was lucky enough to get both editions :)
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by PrincessTrouble »

I went for D1 - one limited and one gilded. Added on a couple of player editions.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by RichK »

PrincessTrouble wrote:I went for D1 - one limited and one gilded. Added on a couple of player editions.
Same, 1 player.
Move on, nothing to see here.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by serubi »

So what's the deal with the Player edition? Is it just a not-as-limited edition?
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by RichK »

serubi wrote:So what's the deal with the Player edition? Is it just a not-as-limited edition?
A display deck so you don't have to open a numbered deck.
Move on, nothing to see here.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by dogbone72 »

Either my math sucks or the total number of gilded decks adds up to 120
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by serubi »

RichK wrote:
serubi wrote:So what's the deal with the Player edition? Is it just a not-as-limited edition?
A display deck so you don't have to open a numbered deck.
Ah, I guess that explains the name :P
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by serubi »

dogbone72 wrote:Either my math sucks or the total number of gilded decks adds up to 120
Your math doesn't suck. You're right :?
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by RichK »

dogbone72 wrote:Either my math sucks or the total number of gilded decks adds up to 120
You're right.
Move on, nothing to see here.
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Re: Tally Ho Pearl Edition from KWP

Unread post by Stepchild »

Snoozed on this one and missed the gilded. Oop!
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