CAUTION! Self-made White Centurions on Ebay

[magiccircle]

I recently won a bid for White Centurions on ebay for USD160 from the seller cards.and.decks and upon receiving the deck, very much to my surprise, the box, the seal and the cellophane are all made up by the seller himself. I was able to recognize it immediately because I have been dealing with USPCC cards for years and I also own the original White Centurions. I made comparison with the original just to be sure and yes I was right. I contacted the seller immediately asking why he sold me a fake. He said it was down to my own mistake for not reading his item description which writes:

This listing is for 1 Bicycle Centurions deck in white box. This auction is made for any collectors who want to have a white cents but don't want to pay $300 for a single deck.

And the listing title is : White Cents Bicycle Centurions Playing Cards by Theory11 in White Box Rare Deck (Item number 261196951094)

In other words, it is actually a normal black centurions in a white box. I would say it is very clever of the seller to word his listing in such a way and anyone less experienced may think that they actually bought the real thing without realizing the fact that it is actually a self-made centurions in a white box. I must say I feel quite disturbed by the fact of this because no one will pay USD160 for such a deck and clearly anyone who pays that would expect an original White Centurions. I saw another buyer bought this not too long ago. I'm a little concerned that these may be circulating around and hence I just wanted to share this out to the magic and card community so you guys are aware of this and be extra careful with the seller's description. I hold no blame against the seller since he really did use clever words in his item description so I take it as my own mistake. But I do not wish anyone to end up with the same mistake as mine though. In the end, I returned the deck for a full refund from the seller.

[BMPokerworld]

I totally disagree with your assessment. He is not being clever, he is being misleading and deceptive. He doesn't say it is fake until the very bottom with a small note he added using a mobile device. Clearly this was done on purpose. Nobody would pay $160 for a fake. If he thought the wording was fine then why did he add the disclaimer on the bottom? He says he has 100% guaranteed satisfaction policy, with a 14 day return period. You should return the item and report him to eBay.

Thanks!

[MagikFingerz]

I totally disagree with your assessment. He is not being clever, he is being misleading and deceptive. He doesn't say it is fake until the very bottom with a small note he added using a mobile device. Clearly this was done on purpose. Nobody would pay $160 for a fake. If he thought the wording was fine then why did he add the disclaimer on the bottom? He says he has 100% guaranteed satisfaction policy, with a 14 day return period. You should return the item and report him to eBay.

Thanks!

These are my thoughts as well. Stuff like adding RARE and LIMITED to every deck listing is one thing, this is deliberate misleading and trying to justify it. People like this should be banned from ebay.

[BMPokerworld]

I totally disagree with your assessment. He is not being clever, he is being misleading and deceptive. He doesn't say it is fake until the very bottom with a small note he added using a mobile device. Clearly this was done on purpose. Nobody would pay $160 for a fake. If he thought the wording was fine then why did he add the disclaimer on the bottom? He says he has 100% guaranteed satisfaction policy, with a 14 day return period. You should return the item and report him to eBay.

Thanks!

These are my thoughts as well. Stuff like adding RARE and LIMITED to every deck listing is one thing, this is deliberate misleading and trying to justify it. People like this should be banned from ebay.

Or at the very least sent to Norway to live as punishment:)

Thanks!

[Magic_Orthodoxy]

Yes I agree, tell him you want a refund as per his page, or you'll report him to ebay for fraud. In the mean time nobody else buy decks from cards.and.decks (seller user name)

I belong to another collector forum that also deals in fakes - we have a section called "buyer beware" where we openly tell the community about bad transactions and instances just like this.

More people need to come forward and share their stories so that others don't fall for the same trap and people like this get their business taken away from them

check his feedback - someone had the same "issue" as you on the same item

Had a problem due to misread of item description but seller solved it for me.

[magiccircle]

Thanks for dropping by to comment, guys. It is people like you that help keep this community safe and clean. Yet there are definitely people like cards.and.decks out there trying to make some quick bucks. If I did not examine the deck closely enough, it would have easily gone by me without having noticed that it is a fake. And thanks for the many suggestions from you guys. Yes indeed I have returned the deck to him and got a full refund but the thing is, he has got nothing to lose for the crime commited. He was a little arrogant when I brought forward the matter to him. He said he was not being dishonest and it was down to my OWN mistake for not reading his item description. And he also wrote:

"I will refund immediately after you left me the feedback. I can't guarantee I won't get the negative feedback after I give the refund. So that's why I will refund after that. There's no use of giving the refund if I still get the negative feedback. I already prepare your $160 in my account. You can just write thanks on the feedback. Hope you can understand my situation as it's not my fault. thanks "

He's trying to force me to leave him positive feedback which I had to at that moment in order to get my USD160 back, which is a lot of money. Anyway guys, it's a shame that such a great collector like him would have to do this to earn that quick buck. I saw that he has some great decks but I'm sure this will deter many buyers from buying from him. He also has a facebook page named cards and decks. Spread the words and hopefully no one else falls for that. Or at least hopefully not too many of these "White Centurions" are circulating around...

[BMPokerworld]

"I will refund immediately after you left me the feedback. I can't guarantee I won't get the negative feedback after I give the refund. So that's why I will refund after that. There's no use of giving the refund if I still get the negative feedback. I already prepare your $160 in my account. You can just write thanks on the feedback. Hope you can understand my situation as it's not my fault. thanks

He can't do that, it is called Feedback Extortion and it is against eBay's policy. File a claim and tell eBay what he did and that he is not honoring his return policy. They will get you your money back.

Thanks!

[Magic_Orthodoxy]

agreed. file a claim. let ebay strong arm him. this is like when someone says, "let's not involve the insurance companies in this."

[agera94]

He's even been exposed for triyng to sell a vintage tax stamped deck. He tries to get around things by saying that you didn't read the description, however he is acting in a way that is intending to be misleading and deceiving and did indeed, mislead and deceive, and is therefore in breach of a lot of countries consumer laws. He can do all he wants to try and claim that you agreed to a legally binding contract, however he was the first party to do wrong, not you.

[walrus]

How can he possibly say it is not his fault? Who would he like to place the blame on?

[DelMagic]

The first two words in the title of his listing - White Cents.

That is misleading.

[cardvolution]

A normal Centurions Playing Cards White Box? That's really something!

[BMPokerworld]

Wow, just won a white centurions on ebay too. Now I'm worried that it is fake. How do you differentiate between the two?

Post the item number

[Magic_Orthodoxy]

well... for one... do you have a link to your completed transaction? Magic Circle didn't get "fake centurions" he got real black centurions.

[JimmyJohns]

I totally disagree with your assessment. He is not being clever, he is being misleading and deceptive. He doesn't say it is fake until the very bottom with a small note he added using a mobile device. Clearly this was done on purpose. Nobody would pay $160 for a fake. If he thought the wording was fine then why did he add the disclaimer on the bottom? He says he has 100% guaranteed satisfaction policy, with a 14 day return period. You should return the item and report him to eBay.

Thanks!

These are my thoughts as well. Stuff like adding RARE and LIMITED to every deck listing is one thing, this is deliberate misleading and trying to justify it. People like this should be banned from ebay.

I also dislike seller who put in title something like this :

Bicycle " insert name", Limited, Dan & Dave, Ellusionist, Theory 11, Blue Crown, VERY RARE