Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

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Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby badpete69 » Tue Feb 13, 2018 2:12 pm  

Sequel to decks from a few years ago

Old project link can be found here https://unitedcardists.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=6548&hilit=leonardo



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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby sinjin7 » Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:28 pm  

It's astonishing that this joker is putting out another playing card project on Kickstarter after all the lies and scandal from the first campaign. Dent du Liar is one of the most unethical deck designers to ever put out a deck. I'm glad Pierre put a link to his previous project in this thread so if there are any who are considering backing this project because they weren't around for his first project, they can read it and be forewarned.
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby TwoPieceFeed » Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:30 pm  

I will not be backing these for a couple reasons:

1. Without doing actual comparisons they don't look different, at all, from the previous campaign. I feel like I would be repurchasing something that I already own.

2. I was not happy with the way the previous campaign was managed or fulfilled.
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby caniveski » Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:38 pm  

I was tempted but glad I read this first.
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby badpete69 » Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:25 pm  

I went back to read the original thread to refresh my memory on what happened with the first project as I remember getting my decks and things were fine... I do agree that the platinum deck was totally mis-represented but in the end, it seems that those who wanted a refund got one. Sinjin i think you were fully compensated right? Maybe his inexperience the first time around made him make rookie mistakes... Anyway all I am saying is I have seen worst project creators than him over the years
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby vasta41 » Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:20 pm  

badpete69 wrote:Anyway all I am saying is I have seen worst project creators than him over the years

Yup: https://www.kickstarter.com/profile/1722808047/about :lol: :lol:
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby shermjack » Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:48 pm  

badpete69 wrote:I went back to read the original thread to refresh my memory on what happened with the first project as I remember getting my decks and things were fine... I do agree that the platinum deck was totally mis-represented but in the end, it seems that those who wanted a refund got one. Sinjin i think you were fully compensated right? Maybe his inexperience the first time around made him make rookie mistakes... Anyway all I am saying is I have seen worst project creators than him over the years


Yeah, he did offer refunds, but it was how he went about the Platinum deck ordeal that put a really bad taste in my mouth. I still think he is a Shyster and I would never back any of his projects...especially a remake of one that I still have multiple decks of :evil:
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby guru » Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:46 pm  

Interesting read. Thanks badpete69 for sharing the link to the old thread.

Given my love with all things gilded, this comment stood out from the previous thread.

In my ongoing discussions with Lawrence at Legends about materials and print techniques, we realized that gilding was not the optimal way to differentiate the Editions. Also, gilding is not recommended when the backs are to be printed to the edges, which was integral to the design and could not be changed. In the end we achieved our design goals through other means, including unique choices on card stock, color, ink and foil.


I don't think it is correct to say that gilding is not recommended when the backs are to be printed to the edges, and the optimal way to differentiate is also incorrect. Look at the Kickstarter decks that came out in the past 1-2 years.

Also, I don't think Taiwan factory (where both Legends and Expert get their decks printed) has got the capability to do the gilding on the decks. I'd checked with them in 2016 and they'd said they don't offer gilded decks.

Yes, there are decks being offered on Kickstarter being printed from either of the two with limited edition and gilded (uber expensive, of course) but they are being gilded by Gamblers Warehouse. Only MPC & GW are offering gilded decks with very small print run according to my knowledge and then you get what you pay for. It is good some of these limited or signature decks are sold at such a high price that no collector is going to open the deck or else........................ :)


Anyways, I think his new project is a reprint with just a few small tweaks but you may or may not notice the difference because the first version was printed with Legends and this one is with USPCC except the stock used where the difference will stand out, of course. If this deck gets done on USPCC's retail stock or the crushed one, then some may cherish the first edition more than ever. Given it is printed in US, he may even offer a limited edition with gilding later in the campaign and get it executed this time.
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby sinjin7 » Wed Feb 14, 2018 5:00 am  

badpete69 wrote:I went back to read the original thread to refresh my memory on what happened with the first project as I remember getting my decks and things were fine... I do agree that the platinum deck was totally mis-represented but in the end, it seems that those who wanted a refund got one. Sinjin i think you were fully compensated right? Maybe his inexperience the first time around made him make rookie mistakes... Anyway all I am saying is I have seen worst project creators than him over the years

To his credit, he did issue me a full refund of the Platinum decks I returned to him. The thing that gets to me the most about this guy is the utter lack of remorse for lying so blatantly about the Platinum edition. If you read the original thread, he actually came back here to UC to defend what he did with the Platinum edition. He basically babbled on about how individual features (such as the uber critical gilding and iridescent finish) aren't important and we shouldn't be caught up in small details like that but to appreciate the project as a whole. And if we didn't like it, he'll give us a refund. This guy makes Jackson Robinson proud. Yes, there are other projects worse than the Leonardo deck in the sense they were outright scams and never delivered anything, but no one is as ruthlessly unethical as this joker.
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby sms69x » Wed Feb 14, 2018 5:13 am  

sinjin7 wrote:To his credit, he did issue me a full refund of the Platinum decks I returned to him. The thing that gets to me the most about this guy is the utter lack of remorse for lying so blatantly about the Platinum edition. If you read the original thread, he actually came back here to UC to defend what he did with the Platinum edition. He basically babbled on about how individual features (such as the uber critical gilding and iridescent finish) aren't important and we shouldn't be caught up in small details like that but to appreciate the project as a whole. And if we didn't like it, he'll give us a refund. This guy makes Jackson Robinson proud. Yes, there are other projects worse than the Leonardo deck in the sense they were outright scams and never delivered anything, but no one is as ruthlessly unethical as this joker.


Exactly this!

And if remembe correctly, he only came upfront regarding the refund after someone mentioned that the deck wasn't gilded at all nor had the iridiscent finish He wasn't man enough to admit he has just ripped his supporters money... So basically this guy is a liar, who will promise whatever he can just to have his money, and then just deliver a very inferior product...
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby TwoPieceFeed » Wed Feb 14, 2018 8:24 am  

vasta41 wrote:
badpete69 wrote:Anyway all I am saying is I have seen worst project creators than him over the years

Yup: https://www.kickstarter.com/profile/1722808047/about. :lol: :lol:

Can we not do this..?

Joke, or not, for the few decks that Jackson screwed up he has ~30 that are great+.

Dent isn't in the same stratosphere as JR.
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby vasta41 » Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:25 pm  

TwoPieceFeed wrote:
vasta41 wrote:
badpete69 wrote:Anyway all I am saying is I have seen worst project creators than him over the years

Yup: https://www.kickstarter.com/profile/1722808047/about :lol: :lol:

Can we not do this..?


I don't know, can we?? Clearly I was joking, clearly my comment was either taken that way and/or passed by all but you, so clearly you did want to do this. While Dent and JR are obviously different and JR has had some very successful campaigns I disagree that only "a few" were screwed up. In fact I've kept an ongoing list that I will not post again because I digress. Back on topic....
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby TwoPieceFeed » Thu Feb 15, 2018 6:47 am  

vasta41 wrote:
TwoPieceFeed wrote:
vasta41 wrote:
badpete69 wrote:Anyway all I am saying is I have seen worst project creators than him over the years

Yup: https://www.kickstarter.com/profile/1722808047/about.. :lol: :lol:

Can we not do this..?


I don't know, can we?? Clearly I was joking, clearly my comment was either taken that way and/or passed by all but you, so clearly you did want to do this. While Dent and JR are obviously different and JR has had some very successful campaigns I disagree that only "a few" were screwed up. In fact I've kept an ongoing list that I will not post again because I digress. Back on topic....

That wasn't transparent, because as your later ramblings admit, you think he's "screwed up more than a few" (even though half of your list is nit-picking and entirely opinionated). And while I am the only one to comment on your provoking post, I am most certainly not the only one that can't fully interpret the implications or tone of what you said. It's emotionless text.

Back on topic, this creator has 0 properly executed campaigns, and this one will likely follow that trend.
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS (wap)

Unread postby Bradius » Thu Feb 15, 2018 8:08 am  

Thanks for the history on the previous campaign. I do have one or two decks from that campaign when I picked up a complete card collection. I didn’t realize this is just a repeat. I will pass on this one. Not gilding a deck he said he would...and then not saying anything. Not good decisions.
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby vasta41 » Thu Feb 15, 2018 8:52 am  

On the large list of people who screwed up KS campaigns (including but not limited to JR :)) it's a shame Dent is high on that list because the theme and artwork on these decks are great. But just ask Erik Mana- great artwork and a poorly run campaign will lose you supporters.
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby TGunitedcardists » Thu Feb 15, 2018 8:54 am  

vasta41 wrote:On the large list of people who screwed up KS campaigns (including but not limited to JR :)) it's a shame Dent is high on that list because the theme and artwork on these decks are great. But just ask Erik Mana- great artwork and a poorly run campaign will lose you supporters.


However, Mana made good on everything in the end. Granted, it was years late, and his biggest mistake was communication. But, he made good on his decks and refunds.
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby vasta41 » Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:01 am  

TGunitedcardists wrote:
vasta41 wrote:On the large list of people who screwed up KS campaigns (including but not limited to JR :)) it's a shame Dent is high on that list because the theme and artwork on these decks are great. But just ask Erik Mana- great artwork and a poorly run campaign will lose you supporters.


However, Mana made good on everything in the end. Granted, it was years late, and his biggest mistake was communication. But, he made good on his decks and refunds.

True, there are different levels of "f ups" but both projects rank high on the list of screwed up campaigns IMO, albeit for different reasons.
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby TwoPieceFeed » Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:53 am  

vasta41 wrote:On the large list of people who screwed up KS campaigns (including but not limited to JR :)) it's a shame Dent is high on that list because the theme and artwork on these decks are great. But just ask Erik Mana- great artwork and a poorly run campaign will lose you supporters.

Completely agree.

I'm glad I wasn't effected by the whole Eric Mana scheme. I was able to pick up all of the V1s, V2s, and V3s after they were delivered. The V3s are such nice decks. Very high on my list of favorite cards.

Same here. I really, really wanted to buy these decks on the aftermarket but after I discovered the lack of features on the Platinum deck (or whatever it was called) I haven't come around to buying them. And the artwork was/is great.
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby shermjack » Thu Feb 15, 2018 2:01 pm  

TGunitedcardists wrote:
vasta41 wrote:On the large list of people who screwed up KS campaigns (including but not limited to JR :)) it's a shame Dent is high on that list because the theme and artwork on these decks are great. But just ask Erik Mana- great artwork and a poorly run campaign will lose you supporters.


However, Mana made good on everything in the end. Granted, it was years late, and his biggest mistake was communication. But, he made good on his decks and refunds.


I disagree! Mana did NOT make good on everything in the end as I did not get some of the decks that I pledged for (I forget which ones they were it was so long ago) nor were they signed as they were supposed to be. Eric Mana is another Shyster in my book :evil:
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Re: Leonardo MMXVIII | Art Playing Cards now on KS

Unread postby alric » Thu Feb 15, 2018 2:43 pm  

TGunitedcardists wrote:
vasta41 wrote:On the large list of people who screwed up KS campaigns (including but not limited to JR :)) it's a shame Dent is high on that list because the theme and artwork on these decks are great. But just ask Erik Mana- great artwork and a poorly run campaign will lose you supporters.


However, Mana made good on everything in the end. Granted, it was years late, and his biggest mistake was communication. But, he made good on his decks and refunds.

Let's remember that Mana didn't complete fulfillment out of the goodness of his own heart, sinjin7 had to resort to suing Mana's unmotivated ass in order for him to finally deliver his decks.

For me, the worst thing a designer can do on a Kickstarter project is to promise features to get you to back them, and then after they got your cash after the project ends they don't deliver those features without telling anyone about it. Since the Olympics is going on right now, I'll award medals to my list of worst offenders:

Gold Medal: Jack$on Robinson/Legal Tender - no holographic foil, no regular foil, crappy printer
Silver Medal: Dent du Lion/Leonardo - no gilding, no prismatic finish, no USPCC printing
Bronz Medal: Mythical deck - I can't even remember that asshole's name, he started with a crappy printer and promised to look into a better printer in order to get funded when people complained, then went with an even crappier printer no one ever heard of.
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