Robert Butler/Loop Cuts

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sinjin7
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Robert Butler/Loop Cuts

Unread post by sinjin7 »

A thread about this topic was opened in the General discussion forum, but I wanted to make sure this issue is put to rest once and for all in the proper forum, so I am trying to import Roberts statement as well as my reply to this thread in the proper forum. A lot of drama is being caused by Robert, so I feel the only way to fully address this is to have full visibility and transparency instead of trying to sweep it under a rug, and hopefully we can get the truth about all this so we can all move on.
Loop Cuts wrote:Hey guys, lets have a sit down and talk about the truth behind me and my past. CBJ is right about one thing, back then I was very messed up and unethical. I'm sure those were never his words exactly but you get the gist. So here it goes....

Two years ago I was highly ambitious about the industry. I spoke to great minds like Jason Brumbalow, Lace Miller, Dave Buck and so on. Shared some of my concepts and some were loved while others were not. I was so eager to make my mark that I put on my running shoes before reading the guide and my ethics were nonexistent. It's not because I wanted to take what I could how I could... It's because I was usually in over my head and when I got into hot water, I tried to fix a problem by creating a new one. I started with a YouTube channel called magicians work shop. It was small but I was reviewing cards in a different way. This gained the attention of a few people and BMPoker was one of them. He sponsored me and sent me tons of decks to review. I suddenly had so much more to do than I had expect and was really happy. Lance was helping me with branding at the time and also teaching me on how to build on something great. With my ambition though, I was it evolving in my head and had to take the steps to see it do so. I then created Modern Manipulator and that was meant to be the next step for me. I had great things going for me and I had finally established a sponsored relationship with Ellusionist, which is very hard to do! I was sent the Red artifice decks way before they were released and had an exclusive interview about them. As I set up the launch of MM I was ready to sell our very first e-mag. After launch though I realized that I was doing something wrong... We sold none of the mags and I was lost... Confused and irritated. I closed MM thinking I could do better, figure it out and get back to the basics.

So as you see, I was already making HUGE mistakes. I had broken a sponsorship with BMPoker, closed two of my projects, creating doubt in the community that anything I was going to do would last. I didn't even see what I was doing was doing more harm than good. Lets speed up the clock a little to a time frame more recognized by many of you....

Conjuring Creations... My come back Idea. A bamboo card clip that was actually pretty cool. My ability to create and design a project had evolved. My concept for marketing had improved and I was getting a better grip on how to manage my own thoughts. I managed to raise enough money to bring about the first prototypes of the ECO CARD CLIP. This was beyond exciting and I charged a very low price to get people interested. HUGE MISTAKE. I didn't realize I was undercutting my self and would damage the entire production and delivery process because of it. I was short on money due to not having enough left over for shipping. I was in full panic mode and I could see the success down the road waiting on me. I sent what I could out then quickly pulled in Encarded as my first client. I figured with profits from that venture that I could make the money, ship everything out and all would be right with the world.

(SEE IT?<--- That is my big unethical mistake... that I repeated over and over because I panicked, because I didn't take the time to research and perfect things.)

Next was 4PM Designs. I pulled them in as my second client before the Encarded clips were even done. The wood shop was overwhelmed by the demand and was kinda lost in a mix of Happy and worried. I know now that I should have perfected the production process, asked the shop the right questions...like... "what would happen if damaged clips came in? What time frame would an order of this size take to complete.?" I didn't even quote any of the clients a time frame. Looking back... I'm ashamed of it all. I had created a perfectly amazing product that was doomed from day one because I was the one that created it.

Over time the timelines were becoming more and more unclear as to when they would be finished and each client was stressed as well. Communication broke down because at one point 4PM Designs was ready to cancel the order but I explained that a refund wasn't possible due to all of the money being invested in production. I told the shop that they were ready to pull out. In confusion, Encarded was told by the shop that I was considering canceling an order and Encarded was ready to flip out... Why in the world was that going on? And it was a break down and mix up between to clients information.

Over the next month or two, things were getting worse for me. I spent my end of the profit, and was also selling some decks to make up for the financial crisis in the making.

PIVOTAL MOMENT: I sold a huge lot of decks to a buyer and also sold a single deck to another. I manged to ship them to the wrong addresses. I panicked in a huge way. I contacted the person that was receiving the huge order to inform them of the mistake and told them I would pay for the return shipping if they could please help me fix it. After many messages back and forth, they claim it never arrived. The person that spent hundreds of dollars on there order was furious. I was now on the line for lips, for the sold decks and I was in a lot of trouble. This is when people started talking EVERYWHERE. I went into hiding..............

......

......

All was silent and I created the FB Alias Lee Zero....WHY? Mainly because I couldn't stop... My brain is a bunch of gears in motion, always building, wanting to create. I should have been taking time to reflect to see how things had become such a mess. But rather I decided to help Vanda get established and help them get there KS deck funded. David decided to keep it secret because he needed the help and he likely didn't understand the depth of my troubles. I helped him get 100% and to CBJ's dismay worked with him as well. During the talks with CBJ I asked him about my self... YEAH, very messed up but I did it because I wanted to know how bad it was for me. I knew the community was very angry with me and I had to know.




Looking back... yeah things were great and I ruined it because of my inexperience and my ambition. I should have taken the time to research, to learn from my mistakes before making new ones. I should have stopped and fixed something vs creating another issue to fix one. I have had the incredible privilege of understanding from people like Lance Miller, Paul Carpenter, and others that prefer not to be mentioned. I NOT ONCE wanted to cause problems or hurt people. I simply would not slow down and focus and listen. I'm still paying the price for it today. I take full responsibility of my actions and bear the burden almost daily. I try to reach out to anyone that comes forwards and offer a solution. I know I cannot stop growing and give up.


FILM FEST QUESTION

Most of the prizes were never sent to me. Only seasons prizes & D&D prizes were. I've spoken to Alex Chin regarding it and he told me that I have to learn from my mistakes and he was hard on me about it. As he should be. D&D prizes were not returned. I never had the money to do so. I don't have a happy ending for a lot of what has happened and I regret it.


WHAT HAS CHANGED?

Well the first step to fixing a problem is always admitting you have one. So here it goes. I'm bad with money, I'm even worse with follow through. I'm bad with people and sometime let my anger speak for me.

I have taken more time that you know to reflect to see the damage I've caused. I now have my partner Katrina White to manage accounts to be sure I'm not tempted with reckless impulses. It allows me to focus on the bigger picture. I also take time now to develop a concept. I let it sit and then come back to it. I know to many of you the Playing Card Awards seems rushed, but I've been planning it for almost a year now.

LOOP CUTS has been selling again recently and we have shipped 100% of our sold products and have kept a clean track record. Things are not the same as they once were.

The Playing Card Awards are in play and it's doing very very well. On day 1 we had 125 nominations and more are coming in. The trophys are being made by a sponsor and will be shipped out by them. Any prizes are being provided by a sponsor and will be shipped out by them as well. The event is 100% on the up and up. I know when my name comes up that many bad things follow but give it a chance, please.




Let me close by saying this. I'm am truly sorry 100% for all the past mistakes. I'm not interested in hiding the truth. I beg each and everyone of you to please, please give me the chance to do what I love. Let me move on and let me grow. I'm now reading "The Purple Cow". It's a marketing book... I want to do the time to research, I want to do right by all of you but I just need the opportunity.

CBJ... I'm sorry man. I know we are past apologies and you simply don't want anything to do with me and I will respect that. I admit to my wrong doing... please just let me be. Let me live my life.


Thank you all for your time.
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Re: Robert Butler/Loop Cuts

Unread post by sinjin7 »

Here is my reply to Robert:
sinjin7 wrote:Here are my issues with this:

1) Its cowardly that this thread is put into the General forum where there is minimal traffic in comparison to the Playing Card Forum and the New & Custom Decks sub-forum. The topics related to you are absolutely and specifically about playing cards and should be in the proper forum, NOT this General forum. To bury it here is a form of censorship in it of itself.

2) You do a wonderful job in detailing your mistakes. The problem is I already knew about all that. I didn't ask for a history lesson, I asked for specifics on how you made full restitution. To me, its not as important to know how you screwed up, but what you did about it. So let's get to it:

3) Did you return the un-reviewed decks back to BMPoker?

4) Have you refunded all the money to every backer and sponsors of your bamboo Eco Card Clips?

5) Did you refund the money for the buyer who bought that huge lot of decks that were allegedly mis-delivered?

6) Did you send back the prizes to Alex Chin and D$D from your failed Film Fest? Of the other prized that weren't sent to you, did you make sure those got returned as well?


Its been over 2 years since you made most of these mistakes, that's plenty of time for you to have made full, or at least partial restitution for your errors. Again, please be specific as to how much or how little of your past mistakes have been corrected. To plead mea culpa and to say you're sorry is cheap and doesn't cost you a dime, and I don't give a damn what you're currently reading. Its all about the money, so tell me if you've refunded everyone's money or property.
Loop Cuts wrote:I know to many of you the Playing Card Awards seems rushed, but I've been planning it for almost a year now.
This sounds like you're much much more involved than merely doing marketing as Mike is claiming. The UC already has the Deck of the Year contest and we have been doing it for the past couple of years. Why do we need this poorly timed award? Of course this is being rushed, how else do you explain the ridiculous mid-year timing where half of the decks from 2013 and half of the decks from 2014 will be eligible? It doesn't make sense. These Cardy awards have nothing to do with UC, are repetitive, unnecessary, and will only serve to compete with, and potentially undermine, the UC Deck of the Year contest. I

I have more integrity than that to be bribed into participating in an irrelevant and unnecessary "award" with the promise of some prizes for my nominations and votes. I have no plans whatsoever to have anything to do with the Cardys unless you can specifically address the above mentioned concerns of mine and show me that you've paid everyone back.

Unlike CBJ, I would be willing to give you yet another chance, but you do not get that chance until you've shown you've made everything right. If you're truly remorseful about your past mistakes, then you will actually correct those mistakes and make things right with everyone. Otherwise all your talk is just lip service and empty apologies without any true remorse.
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Re: Robert Butler/Loop Cuts

Unread post by montecarlojoe »

And here is a link to said thread:
http://unitedcardists.com/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=5441

Please post there if you with - this thread is locked.
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Re: Robert Butler/Loop Cuts

Unread post by volantangel »

Sinjin, I have gone one step further, I've made this an announcement for 3 days, after which this thread will go fade back as a normal topic fading into the records. But like Eoghann has said, please partake in the other thread if necessary, this isn't the right section for this discussion.
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