PlanarenKarten - Planar Art Playing Cards

[BlueToy]

Thanks for the advice. Will keep that in mind. I'll try to email those printers and get quotes to get an idea of the costs involved.

I originally wanted to launch this with 2 other decks - a Tarot and Lenormand one, but as these printers don't do tarot size, I may have to set aside those other two decks for the moment.

I just hope EPCC and LPCC does fulfillment! I understand it can become quite a nightmare!

Also, pardon my ignorance, but what exactly do you mean by a blue version? Black fronts, with blue patterned backs, or... black and blue fronts (sounds like bludgeoned faces!) no reds, and blue patterned backs?

I like the JoC, but there seems to be a little too much empty space with the JoH...maybe make his hand raise the cup to his mouth halfway between the heart pip and his face? I like the concept of the black deck so far, but after looking through the thread again, I also think a blue deck (similar to the sample pattern you provided above) would also be nice.

Though I have never run a KS project before (I have backed a ton of them though), I think 1,000 decks is manageable. From my experience, projects that use LPCC and EPCC as printers range from 5-8K on average and higher if you want to push the limits on what you do with the cards and tucks (i.e. foil, embossing, etc.) I would say that, at a minimum, the successful 5-8K projects have at least 200-250 backers, half of which will pledge for 2 or more decks. If your project is successful, you should have at least 500 decks accounted for and hopefully would have covered your costs (including fulfilment, which I understand is always under-estimated)...the extras you could sell via a website or eBay.

[shermjack]

I just hope EPCC and LPCC does fulfillment! I understand it can become quite a nightmare!

Also, pardon my ignorance, but what exactly do you mean by a blue version? Black fronts, with blue patterned backs, or... black and blue fronts (sounds like bludgeoned faces!) no reds, and blue patterned backs?

Legends does fulfilment

Sorry for the confusion about the blue, I was just making a suggestion for another deck color (not that you need it) as I thought that the Blue/Black patterned fabric you showed as an example was anice color combination and would make a nice companion deck to the red deck.

[BlueToy]

Sorry for the confusion about the blue, I was just making a suggestion for another deck color (not that you need it) as I thought that the Blue/Black patterned fabric you showed as an example was anice color combination and would make a nice companion deck to the red deck.

I see what you mean about the pattern. I've tried applying a blue color scheme to the samples in the first image - one done on an off-white background and the other on a black background. Seems like a tough choice for me! At the end of the day, the second deck will have to be one of the either the red-black. blue-black or blue-white variants (and that is if ever the campaign actually gets past a stretch goal!).

(also, I'm not sure, but I think I tried modelling this queen after Bette Davis)

The second pic has black background samples of the pip cards, the second jester, and an off-white sample of the Ace of Spades.

I'm not sure what text should go in the Ace of Spade, but I'm thinking of going with the visual treatment done in the sample. What do you guys think?

[shermjack]

Wow, tough choice as I really like them all! How would a mix of the red and blue in a single deck look...use the red for diamonds & hearts and the blue for the spades & clubs? Sorry for making suggestions of more decks instead of less Regardless, I agree that when you launch, you need to only start with one deck.

Really looking forward to this deck though...I will definitely get a few of whatever you decide to go with

[blejanre]

I can't honestly say that I'm loving either the black cards or the blue color scheme. Shermjack's idea for both blue and red in one deck is a good one, but I think one colour would give stronger impression (I vote red).

I am loving the ace of spades. It looks damn fine and not overstated. I think the amount of writing on the pip is good, but I would ditch the "inspired by WW" part and sub in something else, the date or country of manufacture or your name or something.

[dazzleguts]

I like shermjack's idea of blue for the black suits and traditional red for the other 2. Would have to see it though since the bue is more subdued and might not be a strong enough partner for the red.

Also like the spades and am glad to see the source acknowledged with "inspired by..."
Perhaps some of the text could go below and/or above the spade to allow more room for larger text within.

[blejanre]

Also like the spades and am glad to see the source acknowledged with "inspired by..."

I'm glad to see it too, but I think it would work better on the tuck.

[BlueToy]

My name's actually in the first line of the AoS. I like the idea of putting the "inspired by..." part in the box. Maybe on the back? Will keep that in mind. BUT what texts are usually on the AoS - especially the modern custom ones seen in KickStarter?

Below are variants of the remaining three aces: plain big suits, plain small suits, and decorative big suits. I tried doing a decorative version of the small suits but didn't like them. Anyway, which of these approaches do you guys think is the best? Thanks!

[blejanre]

ooh, I was going to suggest the small ones until I scrolled down to the big fancy. Go with those for sure. It's a part of the deck where it really works to have extra detail, makes the product as a whole more interesting. Kind of hard to tell without a side by side, but if they're not already, I would make the other three aces just a tad smaller in width than the AoS.

Lookin good

info that can be found on ace of spades:

name of deck
name of designer
name of design company
name of distributor
date of original design
country/city of design
country/city of manufacture
date of manufacture
name of manufacturer
the words "playing cards"
any patent info
any other number that may be pertinent
a dedication? (haven't seen it, but why not?)
catchphrase
something in latin

[shermjack]

I definitely think that the decorative aces would work the best, though I think that the patterns could use some work...for example, the black square in the diamond is a little too bold and takes away from the diamond look as the eyes focus on the black square...same thing with black lines through the heart, too much black I feel...also less red with the clubs. You also seem to have two different styles for the club pips, short & fat (as in the small pip AoC) as well as thin & long (as in the big pip AoC)...I like the short & fat AoC as feel it matches the AoS better while the thin & long reminds me of an airplane silhouette.

[BlueToy]

ooh, I was going to suggest the small ones until I scrolled down to the big fancy. Go with those for sure. It's a part of the deck where it really works to have extra detail, makes the product as a whole more interesting. Kind of hard to tell without a side by side, but if they're not already, I would make the other three aces just a tad smaller in width than the AoS.

Lookin good

info that can be found on ace of spades:

name of deck
name of designer
name of design company
name of distributor
date of original design
country/city of design
country/city of manufacture
date of manufacture
name of manufacturer
the words "playing cards"
any patent info
any other number that may be pertinent
a dedication? (haven't seen it, but why not?)
catchphrase
something in latin

Thanks for the suggestion! They were all the same size, so I'll make the Spades' a bit bigger.

Thanks for the list too. I doubt I can fit all that in the Acem but will try to select the ones more relevant to the project.

I definitely think that the decorative aces would work the best, though I think that the patterns could use some work...for example, the black square in the diamond is a little too bold and takes away from the diamond look as the eyes focus on the black square...same thing with black lines through the heart, too much black I feel...also less red with the clubs. You also seem to have two different styles for the club pips, short & fat (as in the small pip AoC) as well as thin & long (as in the big pip AoC)...I like the short & fat AoC as feel it matches the AoS better while the thin & long reminds me of an airplane silhouette.

You have a good eye! Thanks for pointing out the Clubs. I will probably go with the short and fat ones since your comment made me realize that the long and thin ones have a closer resemblance to the Ditha Moser pack's, albeit with flukes.

Will also try to work on the patterns on the aces, and make the other color less dominant (e.g. for decor of the the red aces, black will be used only sparingly).

Thanks again guys!

[dazzleguts]

Also like the spades and am glad to see the source acknowledged with "inspired by..."

I'm glad to see it too, but I think it would work better on the tuck.

You're absolutely right. Good to hear it will likely go that way.

[BlueToy]

One question: would PlanarenKarten be a good first Kickstarter playing card project for someone who wants to establish a name for himself (in the custom playing card world) in the long run?

I'm asking because I've two other sets of designs (very different from this project) I did years ago which I also want to revamp. I was just wondering if either of the two would make a better "debut" Kickstarter campaign - though of course I want all of them to be produced eventually.

On one hand, I want to start with PlanarenKarten because it will involve a simpler, less complicated campaign - start small, learn the ropes kinda thing. On the other hand, maybe either of the two other designs would have more initial impact and would be a good start in making my playing card art more known and visible to more people.

I've attached samples of the other two (as you can see, both need revamping/reworking, like with the borders, indices, etc).

Not sure if this is the place to post the question or if I should create a new thread on it in the KS section.

[shermjack]

Wow, what completely different styles! It is a little hard to comment on which deck would be better without knowing more about the decks, but I still have a strong preference towards the PlanarenKarten deck as it is very different from all the other decks out there and as you said, is a little more simpler than the other ones you have shown.

[BlueToy]

Wow, what completely different styles! It is a little hard to comment on which deck would be better without knowing more about the decks, but I still have a strong preference towards the PlanarenKarten deck as it is very different from all the other decks out there and as you said, is a little more simpler than the other ones you have shown.

Yeah I try to experiment with different styles since my primary fascination with art is from a taxonomy standpoint (different classifications/styles).

My current mindset actually, is to use PlanarenKarten in my first KS campaign - I'm just having self-doubts as to whether it's appealing enough to be funded (with the rationale being that the other two styles may have more mass appeal).

I read in another thread that creators usually do promotional campaigns first before the actual KS launch of their projects. Any suggestions where they promote their stuff?

Thanks!

[blejanre]

Honestly, I think Planaren is the way to go. Yes, the others may be more mainstream, but that is also their downfall. In order for them to stand out, everything needs to be perfect, from the cardstock to the pip placement, to the font, to the tuck, to the etc. etc. PlanarenKarten will stand out on its own. It may not get as many backers, but you don't need $50 000 to run a successful campaign.

Planar art is a style that's overdone. It will get people's attention while at the same time opening the door for the theme of your "brand" which is the taxonomy of art styles. I think it's a strong opening.

All this coming from someone who has never run a KS campaign and knows little to naught about business, so take it with a grain of salt.

[BlueToy]

Honestly, I think Planaren is the way to go. Yes, the others may be more mainstream, but that is also their downfall. In order for them to stand out, everything needs to be perfect, from the cardstock to the pip placement, to the font, to the tuck, to the etc. etc. PlanarenKarten will stand out on its own. It may not get as many backers, but you don't need $50 000 to run a successful campaign.

Planar art is a style that's overdone. It will get people's attention while at the same time opening the door for the theme of your "brand" which is the taxonomy of art styles. I think it's a strong opening.

All this coming from someone who has never run a KS campaign and knows little to naught about business, so take it with a grain of salt.

Thanks for the advice, nonetheless. I'm trying to learn more about KS myself. Stumbled upon it around 4 or 5 years ago I think. The campaigns were much simpler then. Now, it's such a complex crowdfunding machine that I sometimes feel I need to get a post-grad degree in KickStarter before I can launch a campaign!

[blejanre]

Thanks for the advice, nonetheless. I'm trying to learn more about KS myself. Stumbled upon it around 4 or 5 years ago I think. The campaigns were much simpler then. Now, it's such a complex crowdfunding machine that I sometimes feel I need to get a post-grad degree in KickStarter before I can launch a campaign!

lol And I meant to say that planar art isn't a style that's overdone. oops

[dazzleguts]

I have to agree with Ben that Planar is more unique. Not that your other designs are not unique, they're just more illustrative, which makes them closer to so much of what has already been done. I see you know that since you expect them to have more mass appeal. I know I'm more on the outside fringe of taste so my liking them won't guarantee a KS

I really want to see this deck happen so I'll argue that the first deck will establish your reputation, both for the quality of the art, and for the smoothness of the campaign. Simpler and unique should facilitate that. It would be awful to see these fall by the wayside in favour of mass appeal.

[BlueToy]

I am hoping this deck actually becomes reality too! All of the cards are done, with minor edits underway thanks to the very constructive critique of everyone who's commented. Then on to working on the... accoutrements of a KS campaign. (it doesn't help that me and my associate are in completely opposite time zones! :-/ )

I have to agree with Ben that Planar is more unique. Not that your other designs are not unique, they're just more illustrative, which makes them closer to so much of what has already been done. I see you know that since you expect them to have more mass appeal. I know I'm more on the outside fringe of taste so my liking them won't guarantee a KS

I really want to see this deck happen so I'll argue that the first deck will establish your reputation, both for the quality of the art, and for the smoothness of the campaign. Simpler and unique should facilitate that. It would be awful to see these fall by the wayside in favour of mass appeal.

[BlueToy]

A few more questions:

1) Are those sticker seals important? I mean, do you guys think more buyers would prefer tuckboxes with sticker than without?


2) In terms of timing, would it be better to launch the deck in KS early next year? The timing seems a bit tight if I attempt a launch late this month, what with the upcoming holidays and all.


3) In line with the "start small" approach a couple of posts back, I'm just planning on offering the deck with tuckbox (maybe with the sticker seals). What are good reward tiers? Early bird, one copy, two copies, six copies, and maybe even twelve (would anyone actually pledge for these last two?!!!)? I want to add uncut sheets but doing a separate combo reward for them (like a deck plus a sheet) complicates the reward tiers. Would it be better for these to be offered as add-ons?


AAAND in lack of an image update, here's a downdate or a backdate (my humor, ladies and gentlemen). Attached is one of the earliest versions of the deck, to which I applied the vintage effect. The Moser influence is much more obvious here. I'm not really going to use the design - I just wanted to share how the project looked like in its very early stages.

[shermjack]

OK, so here are my thoughts:

1. Tuckbox seals - though they are nice, they are not a must have...start without one and then you could add them as a stretch goal
2. Timing of launch - I don't think that starting a project would be a problem in regards to the holidays as you will not fulfil until next year anyways...personally, I am quite anxious for you to launch your project and hope it is sooner than later
3. Tiers - 1, 2, 4, 6 & 12 are typical tiers...whether anyone pledges the last two will depend on your final design and printer...if you go with either LPCC or EPCC, I would most likely back for at least 6 decks

Love the old Jack and style, can you show more??! Regardless, very much looking forward to this deck!

[BlueToy]

OK, so here are my thoughts:

1. Tuckbox seals - though they are nice, they are not a must have...start without one and then you could add them as a stretch goal
2. Timing of launch - I don't think that starting a project would be a problem in regards to the holidays as you will not fulfil until next year anyways...personally, I am quite anxious for you to launch your project and hope it is sooner than later
3. Tiers - 1, 2, 4, 6 & 12 are typical tiers...whether anyone pledges the last two will depend on your final design and printer...if you go with either LPCC or EPCC, I would most likely back for at least 6 decks

Love the old Jack and style, can you show more??! Regardless, very much looking forward to this deck!

I messed up. The figure's supposed to be a king haha. I think I never got around to doing the other court letters and numbers as I scrapped the design style altogether since it looked too much like the Moser deck.

To be honest, part of me really wants to try out MPC's new 330 gsm stock, and that their prices seem to be more straightforward and stable - it's a scary thing to be quoted costs only to find out that they've changed come funding time. Plus the fact that they so far have had minimal issues regarding delivery date and that there have been delays with recent projects printed by LPCC and Expert... But, well, that's why they're stretch goals anyway.

And to go off-topic a bit: GSM in these parts refers to gin - as in the alcoholic beverage.

[blejanre]

I've given it a lot of thought, and I think KS campaigns involve a whole lot of psychology. In my opinion, you would be better off going for the smallest print run with LPCC or EPCC and making a larger print run a stretch goal, instead of starting with MPC and making the better quality a stretch goal. First impressions have a huge effect here, and I think you want have the funding goal match the project. It's bad when crappy, low effort projects have a $20 000 goal, it just looks bad. Likewise, if a quality project has only a $1000 goal, or less, people might not know that it is a quality project, or will somehow associate it with lower value (which doesn't make sense). From what I've seen on KS, any tasteful, quality deck can easily make $5000 in a month. I haven't crunched the numbers, but I think that covers the LPCC print run. A lot of backers will see MPC and judge. My two cents.

[shermjack]

From my observations, no matter how good your design, going with MPC will immediately turn away some collectors and cardists...are they getting better, yes...can they compete evenly with the big 3 on some levels, maybe...will some people be turned off, definitely. I for one am one of those who would reduce my pledge from 6-12 to 1-2 when a non-big 3 printer is used and recently have joined the ranks of those who prefer LPCC and EPCC over USPC

[BlueToy]

I did some research and exploring in KS, and it seems like most of the LPCC-printed decks have fund goals of $10K at least. A bit high! But, we'll see. I've emailed LPCC and I'm waiting for their reply.

Also, does anyone here have their printing templates, especially their tuckbox's? Thanks.

[BlueToy]

AAAND they have replied. Any thoughts on LPCC's Emerald finish?

[ecNate]

I just have to finally chime in here. When I first saw this potential deck all I could see was another 8bit style deck, but with the vintage look and other changes I will be considering picking one up. Looking good, glad to see artists leveraging the community ahead of time to make their deck better.

[BlueToy]

Thanks. The inputs of the folks here really helped me in making changes on the design. And I learned some new stuff too along the way.

So... any reviews on LPCC's Emerald finish?

[blejanre]

Someone on a different thread was saying that they would pledge for twice as many decks if the artist went with LPCC's classic finish over their diamond finish. I don't know about any of the finishes, haven't heard anything about emerald.