What do you look for in a deck?

Designing a deck? Need input? Show us here!
Aussie888
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What do you look for in a deck?

Unread post by Aussie888 »

So after watching this forum for a while, it's inspired me to start a (long term) project to design a set of playing cards (I do have a theme in mind, but I'm still fleshing it out, so it's not important right now).
I've seen quite a bit of debate here about what works and what doesn't so I thought I'd ask here before embarking on my quest (yes it's ultimately my design, but people here are likely to know what works).

1) Not being based in the US, trying to use USPCC could be problematic. Are there any other good manufactures that are useful for international designers?

2) Small pips - size and position? How big is too big? How close to the big pips/image is too close?

3) Big pips - size and position? Should the standard pip layout be kept? For example, would (assuming the other features of the deck were ok) the pips on the 8 being in 2 columns of 4, rather than the 3-2-3 layout turn you off?

4a) Royals - Do you prefer the traditional elements of the royals kept (weapons, moustaches etc)?
4b) Royals - Two way or one way royals?

5) Borders - Do you prefer a single colour border? Design right to the edge?

6) Back - Two way or one way back?

7) Colours - Assuming the design works, do you prefer dark or light backgrounds?

8) Other things that help make a design work?


Thanks.
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MagikFingerz
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Re: What do you look for in a deck?

Unread post by MagikFingerz »

1) Assuming you're Australian, the closest one I can think of would be the taiwan factory that has produced some recent decks (Fatboys, Legends etc). Never heard of any Australian printers.

2) I assume you mean the corner pips/value, which is called index/indices. I think functionality is key here. If they're too small to be seen when peeking at them Hold'Em style, they're too small. Image/art being close to indices is trickier, I'd say get as close as you can without them "disturbing" each other. And the closer you put the indices to the edge, the more of the card can be used for art (at least if it's a court) and the better it looks when fanned/spread.

3) Most designers seem to follow the standard layout, but I don't think anyone would be put off by an unconventional layout as long as it's symmetrical. Symmetry should always be in the back of a deck designer's mind.

4a) Royals (or court cards) should follow SOME traditions, but weapons and mustaches are not important. What many prefer is kept, is which ones are "one-eyed", King of Hearts being the "suicide king", and probably a few other things I'm forgetting.
4b) Two-way makes for MUCH better symmetry, so unless your art absolutely can't be reversed for some reason, try to make two-way court cards.

5) I think everyone has different preferences here. Though if you use borders, try to make them rather thin. Think of them as the frame of your artwork; a small painting in a giant frame just doesn't look right.

6) Again, two-way makes for better symmetry. To me, two-way designs are "playing card artwork", while one-way designs are "artwork on a playing card" (if that makes sense). Anyone can put their art on playing cards, but to really make it work you should create the art FOR a deck of playing cards.

7) Doesn't really matter as long as the colors you use fit with each other. Having a consistent theme, therein a suitable color scheme, is another thing that makes for a well designed deck.
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montecarlojoe
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Re: What do you look for in a deck?

Unread post by montecarlojoe »

I agree with everyting MagikFingers has said, but I'll add a couple of further comments:

2. What rules you follow here will depend on your intention for the deck - for example if you emulate a vintage deck you may have tiny squeeezers and no indices or eliminate squeezers and indices altogether, and just keep the suit pips. For functionality you want to keep both index and squeezers, and might also consider "left-handed" squeezers as an addition (see the Deco deck for example).

3. Not much to add to MF here - keep it as symmetrical as you can (obviously tough with odd numbers - look at 3 of Clubs/spafdes hearts in the standard layout). I'd say you have some leeway even with that providing there is strong enough thematic reasons (e.g if it's a transformation deck)

4. Again not much to add - depends on the intent - for functionality (gaming / magic) two way symmetry is essential. For an art deck, one way portraits , or "two way" non symmetrical designs (see lucky playing card co. concept) are fine IMO. Again the strength of the theme and artwork involved would probably sway a lot of people.
BUT customisation beyond simple recolouring of the courts is a must (the only area Deco falls down for me.)

5. It depends on the theme and your printer - they may dictate how far out you can take designs. A cutting error of 1/4 mm might seem like nothing but it's VERY noticable with very thin borders or complex edge detail. Ways around this that have been used in the past are "textured" backgrounds (e.g. fed 52), or colour gradients (e.g. Tendril)
My preference varies - I like minimlaist done well and one colour would suit that, but I also like intricacy... all down to theme!

6. Two way - I can't think of any situation beyond a purely art deck where a one way back is anything but a disadvantage.

7. Either is fine by theme, but personally I HATE inverted colour courts on dark backgrounds. Also as a preference keep the front and back similar in colour - IMO a light front and dark back is wierd. (Again the black Deco deck is a nice example). (Or at least have the borders on front and back matching...)

8a. There was an interesting discussion on the "rules" of back design. 2 way as mentioned is a must, but because of the way we read (top to bottom) your eye tends to be drawn to the top of the card first, and then travel toward the middle - so making sure that all the elements in the top half are "right-side-up" is more pleasing to the eye. (Sprouts will tell you he looks at the middle first and looks up, but the idea is the same).

b. For similar reasons (majority in the west read from left to right) and the fact that it is exposed in right handed fans the Top left corner of the back design should be thought about carefully. For "left handed" / reverse fanning the top right corner should be similarly considered.

c. Lastly think Theme. If you are picking one stick to it, be consistent, but also make sure all the elements tie together without feeling overworked / over designed. The System 6 Believe deck is an example of how not to do that - the stated infulence of Indonesian shadow puppets was nowhere to be seen, rather a mishmash of South-American tribal art, illunimati style references and pig ugly courts was the result. the aces were really lovely though!

Edited for an immense number of typos!
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Re: What do you look for in a deck?

Unread post by MagikFingerz »

All great additions, MCJ. I knew there was more ;)

I'll also say this: Any decks we've named in our posts should be possible to find by searching for them in this very forum, most decks have their own thread somewhere.
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Aussie888
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Re: What do you look for in a deck?

Unread post by Aussie888 »

Thanks MagikFingerz and montecarlojoe.
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